This happened a few years back but still to this day when I think about it I get a little shock of pain in my heart. When Covid started, a small group of women and I started a virtual AA meeting so we could continue to connect and have meetings when we could no longer do so in person. We all got close and it was a great little group.
Covid restrictions began to wane and we planned a weekend trip to this awesome big house in the mountains (if memory serves, altogether it was 9 or 10 of us). There was a firepit, the property was gorgeous, we all were really excited. It then became known to me that the brother of one of the women in the group was planning on attending and it just kind of put a pit in my stomach. I thought this was going to be a women’s trip for our group. I felt put off by this brother, who I didn’t know, joining. He also wasn’t sober, also not an alcoholic, just a social drinker. I can’t imagine he would’ve drank during the weekend but I also wasn’t sure. Let’s call the girl with the brother “Julie” & her brother can be “Joe”.
As a person who tries to do her best to communicate openly and straightforwardly (with discretion of course – I def don’t think just because I think something it must be said) I reached out to Julie directly and was very very careful with my words because I did not want to offend. The goal was to say how I was feeling and gently ask/suggest if this weekend away could remain a trip for our sober group of women, sans Joe. She did not like this, and quickly began surveying other women in the group to see if they also felt this way. Some did, some did not. Things started to spiral. These were my friends and I had hoped my saying “I’m not super comfortable with Joe coming” wasn’t going to be so problematic but it became clear that there were women in the group that wanted to caretake Julie & Joe’s feelings and mine were not as important. I am all about inclusivity, but I didn’t want to take this trip with a guy I didn’t know (who may or may not have brought booze).
Ultimately the trip was cancelled, and I felt deeply disappointed. The kicker is, the majority of the group went on to plan a camping trip without me, inviting Joe. I only found out because the 3 women who had my back, were invited and told me they declined. Me and those 3 ended up going on our own camping trip and had a nice time but man were my feelings hurt. I didn’t understand how the group couldn’t be objective i.e., if an all-female group of bridesmaids went on a trip, why would one person bring their brother? Or at least, why not bring it to the group and ask “hey would it be cool if I invited so & so”. We planned trip for the members of our group/mtg. There was no talk of bringing significant others or additional guests.
AITA for asking Julie not to bring her brother Joe on that trip?
NTA It’s rude to include an additional guest without asking everyone if they are ok with it.
And it’s really rude to bring an uninvited male guest to an outing with 9 or 10 women. Two is not a “female” outing; 10 females is a female outing. OP is NTA.
NTA.
You didn’t know him, the dynamic of an all-women’s trip vs. a trip with a guy is VASTLY different, she invited her brother without asking the whole group, and you asked nicely to not have someone you don’t know who may or may not be bringing an intoxicant to a sober party along with them to please find a different trip to attend.
Julie is selfish, but it sounds like she did you a favor – she outed the people who would rather have a party than a supportive group.
Multiple times I’ve heard my female friends talk about a time where a girl’s trip was ruined because one invitee decided to bring a guy. I don’t know what’s wrong with these ladies who decide to do this, but I SERIOUSLY question the guys who want to go on an all-girl’s trip. Usually, from the stories I have personally heard, it’s an insecure boyfriend. What kind of miserable creature wants to ruin the vibe for everyone else?
NTA btw
NTA, it was supposed to be a girls trip, so case closed so to speak. And think about it this way that you probably had a much much better time with the girls who had your back, even if your feelings were hurt by the others.
NAH. Imho. Youre welcome to say your uncomfortable with it. But they can also do what they want without you. They dont owe you anything and vise versa.
NTA. But Julie is. Who includes a brother no one knows in a women-only support group trip? That’s beyond presumptuous.
I can’t understand why Joe would want to go. NTA
Probably because recovering addicts are often quite vulnerable and he might be looking for an easy target? I may be overthinking his motives but that was my first thought when OP mentioned that he’s neither sober nor an addict.
Nta. Werid of Julie to assume she could bring any guest. Especially weird for it to be a man. Even weirder when its an AA group and hes not in AA. What i find especially odd is that 5 or so other women didnt find it odd. How did everyone meet? My guess is they knew julie and joe before you somehow. And that caused them not to see it objectively.
NTA There was more than one reason the trip could be presumed to be best restricted to normal members. It’s not just that it’s all girls, which is reason enough really, but there’s the AA angle (the purpose of the group). This means that the atmosphere of the entire event would change because of his inclusion. Some things couldn’t be said or done, and he couldn’t be expected to act with understanding of the group, and the AA aspect, if only because he has never been part of it. If he is the only outsider to the group, the only male, and the only person not involved in AA it only makes sense to ask if it’s okay if he can come first.
I don’t know why other women took their side when it seems obvious that it wasn’t appropriate to just invite him and assume everyone would be fine with it. I can only imagine that as she took it badly, no matter how careful you were to breech the subject, she didn’t relay the story in a calm, balanced way either and people probably got the wrong impression of how you brought up the subject with her.
NTA
You are a part of a group of women who are battling an addiction and working on maintaining sobriety. That comes with the inherent agreement that your meetings are a safe place to share and support and not be judged. Ben is not a part of that group. And it’s not about gender; it’s about being part of a group who discuss sensitive and deeply personal information.
I’m so sorry this happened to you.
NTA
It was planned as an all women trip. I find it a little concerning that a man who isn’t sober nor an alcoholic would be keen to go on a trip with a bunch of potentially vulnerable women he’s never met. Maybe I’m overthinking his motives but it set off alarm bells for me.
NTA. It was introduced as a women only trip with people who are strictly sober. Your friend then introduced someone who is the complete opposite of those things, you’re not out of line for feeling the way that you did.